hello-world: description forces implementation

[ErikSchierboom]

The description.md file of the hello-world exercise contains the following text:

Write a function that returns the string "Hello, World!"

While this may seem innocuous, not all tracks are using a function to return the string "Hello, World!".

Case in point: F#

While we could make F# use a function, I'd rather not to as it adds unnecessary overhead.

Apart from that, some tracks only have methods (which are a special type of functions), so the terminology seems wrong there too.

Maybe we could come up with an alternative description?

[petertseng]

When we removed the language of "Write a program to do X" in #321 we considered alternatives:

• Write a function to do X
• Write code to do X
• Do X

It seems that in most cases, "Do X" was used in #528 (to clarify, the verb differs based on what the exercise is; it's not literally the word "do"; often it will be "implement X", etc.)

If we were to take that approach here, then perhaps we're looking at something like...

Produce the string "Hello, World!"

It's not easy to come up with a lowest common denominator wording, that's for sure.

Here's another idea, based on the fact that (to my knowledge) we've generally agreed that stubs should be provided:

Modify the provided code so that it produces the string "Hello, World!"

[ErikSchierboom]

Here's another idea, based on the fact that (to my knowledge) we've generally agreed that stubs should be provided:

Modify the provided code so that it produces the string "Hello, World!"

I really like this suggestion. We have indeed mandated stubs, so this fits with that nicely.

[peterloane]

Would the following wording be clearer?

Change

Modify the provided code so that it produces the string "Hello, World!"

to
Modify the provided code so that it displays the string "Hello, World!"

[glennj]

If the language wants the string returned, that's not really "displaying". "Producing" is more apropos.

[peterloane]

Yes, displaying is not an improvement.

Producing just seems a bit opaque to me here.
Would "output" be better?

Modify the provided code so that it outputs the string "Hello, World!"

[siebenschlaefer]

Or "returns"?
[Edit: SleeplessByte is right, I didn't pay attention to the start of this discussion]

[SleeplessByte]

@siebenschlaefer the point is that there are languages where it's not a function and thus there is no return (neither implicit or explicit).

[ErikSchierboom]

"Producing" might be a bit opaque, but that is also a benefit here :)

[peterloane]

What is wanted should be as clear as possible though

'The classical introductory exercise. Just say "Hello, World!".'
but what is wanted is
'The classical introductory exercise. Just output "Hello, World!".'

[ErikSchierboom]

but what is wanted is
'The classical introductory exercise. Just output "Hello, World!".'

I don't think this is the straightforward answer, as outputting can very easily be interpreted as: print to the console, which is not what we want.

[SleeplessByte]

Perhaps: The result should be "Hello, World!", leaving it in the middle what "result" means?

[peterloane]

I don't think this is the straightforward answer, as outputting can very easily be interpreted as: print to the console, which is not what we want.

Yes, it could be interpreted as print to the console, or write to a file, or any other form of output.

But note the HelloWorld link included starts with 'A "Hello, World!" program generally is a computer program that outputs or displays the message "Hello, World!"', which is also not what is wanted then?

To avoid unwanted interpretation, the specification of what is wanted would need to be more precise I think. (Any ambiguity or opacity leaves it open to interpretation.)

If print to the console is not wanted for example, then what is it that is wanted?

[iago-lito]

Yeah, why not be explicit with something like "Return the chain 'Hello World!' or display it to the console, or write it to a file, depending on the language track." ?

[junedev]

It might not be perfect but I think this suggestion made above is substantially better than what we have currently so I would vote for using it for now.

Modify the provided code so that it produces the string "Hello, World!"

[ErikSchierboom]

Anyone interested in doing a PR? 👼

[SaschaMann]

Is this exercise still relevant? I thought it had been replaced by the Goodbye, Mars -> Hello, World exercise?

[ErikSchierboom]

@SaschaMann That is the very same exercise :)

[ErikSchierboom]

With https://github.com/exercism/problem-specifications/pull/1926/files merged, this can now be closed.